Tree of Savior CBT2

[Sairii]

So yeah the tos cbt2 starts 27th October at 03:00 AM UTC-4 i think.

Aaaaanyways lets make a list of who plays where as what or something...

 

IGN: Sairii

Level: 175ish

Class: FS Cleric

Server: Laima

Edited November 21, 2015 by Sairii

[exec]

IGN: Exec

Class: Swordsman

Server: Laima

Edited October 27, 2015 by exec

[Miro]

IGN: Miro

Class: Cleric

Server: Laima

[Cryptic]

idk which one is needed for adding (so confusing ><)

Char Name: Cryptic

Party Name: Crypted

Class: Wizard

Server: Laima

Edited November 7, 2015 by Cryptic

[0x64]

IGN: Cicero

Level: 55

Class: C3Wizard

Server: Laima

What do you guys think about the game? Honestly I am very disappointed. Sure it has got absolutely beautiful visuals just like blade and soul, but I think they have the some problem: extremely linear progression and lack of content and depth.

All you do is quest after quest. Quests drag you to one place and another, open world map are like narrow tubes which are essentially paths linking npcs and event points. You only go to the appropriate place fit for your level and quests. After you finish a zone you never go back to that place. Not to mention quests are very boring. Nothing stands out. You always walk past beautiful sceneries on a tube map, kill monsters which have no AI and charge straight at you while running slower than you. It's like a mundane task repeated over and over again..It gets boring... I could go on and on...

Strangely I feel it is like playing the YS series or the legend of hero 6 single player RPG(at least the tube maps look similar)..which I played 8 years ago. lol

I really tried to enjoy tree of savior but I can't stop thinking how mabi had wayyyy more content and fun. When playing mabi i feel it really is a world full of possibility. There are just SO MANY things I can do. I remember back in the days I used to be crazy for mabi and I would play it all night. There were always things for me to do and I never felt bored. However when playing TOS or BNS, I feel like I just got this single (linear progression) task to do. I don't even read the quest dialog cuz I know it is going to be killing x amount of monsters or something of that sort. I just want to get it over with. Then I wonder, what is the point? Sure I can spend 2 weeks, grind thru all these "tasks" and reach max level, but what is left to do then? 

I quit mabi in early 2013 in search of a more modern MMO better than mabi. But now I've completely given up. Not only have I not found a better one, I think the new MMOs are light years behind mabi in terms of content and actual fun. I think I will never see another mmo as good as mabi....never again

Edited November 13, 2015 by 0x64

[Pikachu]

Wall of text

This. Very much this.

[exec]

While I agree that they did a sub-par job with the world design so far, you simply chose the wrong game if you were looking for exciting quests or variety. I'm under the impression that ToS tries hard to appeal to the old RO players, who still like that concept, and imo they do that rather well. As one of those players, I can say that ToS gives me much of what I've been looking for over the years. It's not a direct competitor to Mabinogi or all the WoW-clones, it targets a rather specific audience.

I don't like how people keep criticizing lack of content in games that are still in beta or even alpha though. Of course Mabi has a lot of content now, it's been out for over 10 years. But do you remember G1? Or the beta of Mabinogi? Do you know what it looked like during its alpha? (Like the actual betas and alphas, not the kind of betas where only the localization and servers are tested.) There wasn't that much to do, there wasn't a lot of variety. If they released that game today, everybody would probably be like "this is boring, WoW has so much more content!"

[0x64]

Yea I guess I misphrased it. It is not the lack of content that is the problem. It's rather the lack of quality content. 

Here I quote from somebody who said it well in an official TOS forum thread.

Though seriously, ToS is Quantity over Quality.
Maximum number of classes; minimum number of skills. At least half of which are useless and after 2-3 ranks, and you're forced to drop most of the ones that are useful due to skill scaling.
Maximum number of maps; minimum quality of terrain. Islands and Bridges everywhere...
Maximum number of mobs; minimum quality of mobs. Almost every mob 1-120 is AoE food. No hp, no damage, bad skills, terrible AI.
Maximum number of quests; minimum quality of quests. Doesn't really need an example...
The list goes on... and on... and on.

A good game, and pretty much every good mmo made in the last 10 years should be quality over quantity, at least in the beginning. If the people like a game's quality, they'll stick around and demand more. That's when quantity gets added: over time, with the support of the players to direct the way the game should be made.
You can't start with quantity and expect people to stick around while quality is added. What are they meant to do in the meantime? Play content that sucks donkey balls and makes them want to quit and pour bleach in their eyes?

I guess you could say the game actually has a fair amount of content already. Lots of tube/island maps, lots of quests, lots of mobs, lots of bosses...But these content are...shallow. Everything is the same deal and dull.

All tube maps are same and only the function they provide is linking you to next quest/npc island.
All quests are similar and boring (kill x number of monster, gather x amount of quest drop).
All mobs are same -  stupid, slow, no AI. Just lure a bunch of them and give them an AoE. Anyone and their grandpa can do it.
All boss fights are same...They are so easy and predictable you can sit down to recover hp and sp during boss fights. I guess IMC knows this so they added the traps and the weird bullet spam just to add some difficulty. Boss are supposed to be rare, difficult, memorable and original. That is totally not the case here.

Do you honestly remember the monsters and bosses you have fought in TOS? I bet you don't because they are simple, generic and all the same. Whereas in mabinogi we know each monster beacuse they are different. Fighting a spider is definitely not the same thing as fighting a bear. Fighting a bear is not the same thing as fighting a golem..etc. I just don't think the devs put enough or hardly any effort into designing and implementing depth in the content in TOS. 

And tell you what. I did play mabinogi beta. It was back in early 2005 when I played the Chinese mabi beta in horrible 200ms+ lag. I recall back then there wasn't such a thing called closed beta, let alone cbt1, cbt2, cbt3, etc. It was just beta and that was it. Back then mabi wasn't even f2p. It was p2p.
I remember clearly what sort of content was in that G0(pre G1) version of mabi. Just like the person said in the quote. It was quality over quantity. I don't wanna do a detailed comparison between G0 mabi and TOS. But G0 mabi gave me a strong impression of a virtual world that is fun, full of possibility, and challenging. While TOS just gives me this impression of a virtual world in which you only have this boring linear progression task. There is nothing else you CAN or NEED to do. It's like I am in a loop....

for( int i = 1; i < MAX_LEVEL; i++){
AcceptQuest();
GoToLevelLockedIsland(i);
KillAndGather();
TurnInQuest();
}

LOL! how fun is that? This combined the fact that the content is shallow...I don't know about you but I really don't see this game being able to keep its players.

And this

Edited November 14, 2015 by 0x64
spelling

[Cryptic]

I kinda agree with this. The game doesn't (as far as I have played) have any type of co-op encouragement. I remember when I first played mabi after beta. It was the things I did with others that really stood out. If it weren't for people helping me out when I first joined, I would have never kept playing mabi.

[Sairii]

I kinda agree with this. The game doesn't (as far as I have played) have any type of co-op encouragement. I remember when I first played mabi after beta. It was the things I did with others that really stood out. If it weren't for people helping me out when I first joined, I would have never kept playing mabi.

Yep.

The content is 95% soloable. Or rather 95% soloing is the best way to level up.
There is no need to go to high level areas because the exp is even worse than the exp you would get from mobs on or below your level.
Grinding? It's almost impossible to grind mobs. Very few spots to grind, almost no variety at all and simply not enough monsters or rather shitty respawn.

High risk and no reward, thats tos in a nutshell right now. Oh and also quest grind.

Add to that the current imbalance of classes, buffs and stats.

Right now im just playing for the sake of reaching rank 6 / Oracle. Not sure if they will even change anything.
Seeing how korean tos goes open beta / release december next month.

 

Right now:

If I look from my RO fan perspective: It's not worth playing on release.
If I look from my MMORPG fan perspective: It's not worth playing on release.

Edited November 15, 2015 by Sairii

[MajorCyto]

@exec private server to the rescue to re-balance the leveling, and add better end game content and bosses with scripting! 

Edit: Actually wasn't there a case for a mmo where the private server community ended up in the end doing BETTER than the official game... i think it was rose online or something. I remember seeing the private servers having way better sites, tools, and content than even the official one lol.

Edited November 16, 2015 by MajorCyto

[exec]

@exec private server to the rescue to re-balance the leveling, and add better end game content and bosses with scripting! 

Edit: Actually wasn't there a case for a mmo where the private server community ended up in the end doing BETTER than the official game... i think it was rose online or something. I remember seeing the private servers having way better sites, tools, and content than even the official one lol.

It's not that hard to get ahead of official servers. After all, mostly you only have to worry about the server side. And if a group of people is actively perfecting a server emulator, you have a whole community just producing custom content for their servers and the public. That can be quite an advantage, even if the technical quality might not be as high as from the official devs.

[Sairii]

Well then... the high level chars are still hyping this game (well i guess otherwise they wouldnt be high level)....

Am I the only one near lvl 160 that actually dislikes the game the way it is atm?

 

Well anyways let the fanboys protect their holy fail. Maybe imc will do stuffs but i doubt dat.

The game could be awesome with some changes.... *looks at exec*....

Pserver with a map editor.... MAP EDITORRRR... *looks at DeleteIT*

[xeroplz]

The game is sort of repetitive in a way I could deal with but wouldn't consider fun.

- Bosses literally do the same thing every time

- Quests are the same thing most of the time

- Money seems like a big issue, even though I haven't gotten that far.

I'm only level 43 max but I just stopped playing after Tenet Chapel F2.

Also another thing I don't really see is the importance of jumping in the game. Any monster with magic or range will hit you in the air regardless, and to dodge melee it's as simple as running in the opposite direction. Their map structure limits jumping on props to very specific things and when you most want to jump over something, they force you to run around.

Edited November 19, 2015 by Petch

[Sairii]

- Money seems like a big issue, even though I haven't gotten that far.

U get loads of money late game and early on you starve.

[MajorCyto]

U get loads of money late game and early on you starve.

Ah yes, what is that called...

Trickle Down Economics? Those darn 1% high level players. >;o (hah)

[Sairii]

Actually its not that bad.

With level 50 you should already swim in money.